Amarna Forum

Hello 
If this is an irrelevant question, please delete thread. 
Why Amarna forum? why the like of Akhenaten, who has shown up in some of the forum banners?
As a sidenote, I adore Egyptology (and Hitler, which is why I'm here) so I'm somewhat interested in the like for Akhenaten; Sure he's very fun/interesting and the theology behind the Aten thing is interesting, but why him? 

(as a sidenote, I like Senusret iii for his (quite interesting) statuary, treatment of Nubians (whom would form a cult around him) and my own general like for the middle kingdom) 

Also if anyone is interested in Egyptology would be good to discuss 

(thread moved, apologies Anthony)

The first Amarna Forum was named such because of the interests of its creator. The idea of a new kingdom and a new order felt fitting, perhaps.

(03-28-2024, 08:50 PM)anthony Wrote: [ -> ]The first Amarna Forum was named such because of the interests of its creator. The idea of a new kingdom and a new order felt fitting, perhaps.

Thank you, very cool!

there are many times where Egyptian civilization essentially "restarts" or resets itself, however these are always after disasters.
Akhenaten is interesting because he changes fundamentally the direction of Egyptian civilization during a time of great prosperity.
there are many quite humorous stories about him, like how he rode everyday in an electrum chariot through his new city (may have blinded pedestrians), or how he made foreign dignitaries get heatstroke by providing no shade in his court (this was a genuine complaint made to him). He also seems to have been interested in history (buried with early Egyptian artifacts) although his vision is more interesting than any of these silly anecdotes. 

Also, I have an interesting paper I can post which (using Tutankhamun's DNA) makes some very interesting if somewhat dubious claims. One of which is that Akhenaten likely had no deformities, so the unusual statuary was a choice, which seems like a popular opinion in Egyptology.

Quote:he made foreign dignitaries get heatstroke by providing no shade in his court

"It seems you are not favored by Aten, as his agent, I will put you to death to save him the trouble"

If someone did die from heatstroke in Amarna, it might count as a sacrifice to the Aten.......
A sacrifice that was received.

What is your belief on the Egypt - Atlantis connection?
The story of Atlantis of course is relayed to Solon by Egyptian scholars, but beyond that, there are some intriguing questions about the dating and purpose of the Pyramids. Skeptics question the purpose of the Pyramids being tombs due to the fact that they lack any of the ornamentation one would expect of a Pharaohnic tomb.

I'm pretty sure he was just very interested in cults more than anything.

Aizen Wrote:What is your belief on the Egypt - Atlantis connection?
The story of Atlantis of course is relayed to Solon by Egyptian scholars, but beyond that, there are some intriguing questions about the dating and purpose of the Pyramids. Skeptics question the purpose of the Pyramids being tombs due to the fact that they lack any of the ornamentation one would expect of a Pharaohnic tomb.

Long post

at a personal level, I do not know much about Atlantis, so I can't really comment. I know there was an abundance of redheads in the Delta, but the Delta was a miscegenated shithole that was conquered by the "real" Egyptians early on (Note; Pharaohs, from at least the 19th Dynasty (Ramesses ii) were redheads, but that's another topic). I also believe there is excellent evidence for the race native to Lower Egypt as being the "Egyptians" as we know them. Obviously their origins (intentional and not) are somewhat obscure, but personally I don't believe they are Mesopotamians or Atlanteans or anything like that, unless we could go back 7000 years or so and prove they are foreign. (this is tenuous and a personal belief, but one I can justify if pressed). At the very least the people who would come to rule ancient Egypt would most likely exist as an ethnicity by around 3500 B.C. 

On the tomb question, that's fairly interesting: there's precedent of decorated tombs going back to predynastic (about 3500 BC) era with the "decorated tomb" at Nekhen/Hierakonpolis, and the first Pyramid, that of Djoser, seems to have had extensive internal decoration. 
Why not the pyramids of the 4th dynasty? a question made more intriguing by the later Pyramid text tombs. The best explanation would be that the decorations were to be found in the preceding mortuary temple Infront of the pyramid (which were definitely decorated as you would expect). For a point of comparison, one may look at both the noble mastaba tombs of the same period and the early dynastic tombs; wherein there was very little if any decoration in the burial chamber/s but extensive decoration in the public facing mortuary cult chambers, so that the spirit of the dead would be facing out into the world and could interact with it. 


Ultimately though me (or anyone) claiming any true interpretation of the pyramids or anything that early is fraught with difficulty: for example, in early Egypt the strongest evidence of a civil war is the lack of major monuments/veiled references to difficulty and a weird cartouche (Serekh) and some offhand comments on a pot. thus my true reason for believing that the Pyramids were built as tombs is because I believe/like the idea of the Royal (Naqadan/Tjeni) Egyptians as this great conquering race who had a spectacular view of the cosmos, and who were both so intoxicated by this vision of the universe and so technically competent that they could create these tremendous monuments as a form of cultural expression (indeed, using conventional Egyptology one could say these monuments helped sustain the world in the Egyptian mind) totally removed from the mundane necessities of life (maintaining the state). A will/vision so intense that even when possessing much greater means, no civilization has really managed to surpass them (in a single monument, that is). I feel similarly about Karnak temple. 
I further like the idea of them being a burial because it synthesizes everything good about the pyramids into one individual, one man standing as a god on earth who embodies (and perhaps was the end product of) this spectacular state and all it's excellences, who by occupying the Pyramid (even in soul (or Ba?) if their mummies are not still there) almost animates it with the spirit of Egypt as it existed then. 

To me, that kind of interpretation, or of understanding of history, as either/and a series of lessons and a great story/legacy, is what makes it worthwhile. The female/materialist practice of seeing it as a series of sentences to memorize is repugnant to me. Thus, to return to your question a bit, because of both how difficult it is to know anything about the pyramids except their incredible uniqueness AND you coming from a relatively similar interpretation of history as me, I can't outright deny what you're saying; any counters I offer, however reliable, still can't build a proper vision of what the pyramids are because there is very little that's concrete, and while I believe that my interpretation is more true than yours I can't definitely say so.

I have to say that whoever is right--or closer to the truth, rather--yours is a beautiful understanding of that tradition, far surpassing my own passing interest, as mine is an interest in the existence of an earlier civilization, but yours is a true love for that particular culture.

Aizen Wrote:I have to say that whoever is right--or closer to the truth, rather--yours is a beautiful understanding of that tradition, far surpassing my own passing interest, as mine is an interest in the existence of an earlier civilization, but yours is a true love for that particular culture.

Thank you, I appreciate it 
I hope you find what you are looking for in those earlier traditions