Is it impossible to self improve?
#1
I've seen this sentiment go around circles online that self improvement and "becoming normal" are inherently impossible. I've seen people in response to the norwood bully larp ("I'll shove you in a locker nerd!!") say things along the lines of how some people "will never be the alpha". I've also seen people talk about how amarnites and trannies are similar in the sense that they're both outcasts and only differ in the way they deal with it. There's also of course this famous 4chan greentexthttps://imgur.com/a/AWd9jJJ. So, with all this in mind, is it actually impossible to self improve or go up in the social hierarchy? Or is all of this just retarded?
#2
I think "self-improvement" is a set of cargo cult practices that fundamentally don't address what's wrong with the person in question, like re-shingling a house whose foundation is sinking into the mud. Often it becomes an almost masturbatory pursuit where people try to contort themselves into something contrary to their natural inclinations. Like it says in the King Crimson record sleeve "Discipline is a means to an end not an end in and of itself". And if one's natural inclinations are self-destructive there's an issue at a more fundamental level than not getting cardio. But obviously eating healthy, getting sunlight and exercise are positive things, I don't think anyone can deny that.
#3
The concept of fomo is the calling card of a normie- besides how could anyone look around and want to be "normal". I did the whole self improooover bs, leased a nice apartment in a city with popular nightlife and it was awful. People who only talk about other people and what they did last weekend (getting drunk). Boring as fuck.

Feels like most people are dopey reddit "sitcom dad" archetypes who are okay with life and women totally doormatting them. The other camp is some 'alpha' with a sleeve tatt, facial cokebloat, some sort of beardcope + that dumb pidgeotto hairstyle and look like they're either Mexican, Turkish, North Indian or Armenian (The Nightclub race).

Lifting and not looking like a slob is great but the only "improoovement" that matters is making money so you can buy freedom and the ability to just pick up and do things.
#4
(05-11-2022, 06:33 PM)FruitVendor Wrote: The other camp is some 'alpha' with a sleeve tatt, facial cokebloat, some sort of beardcope + that dumb pidgeotto hairstyle and look like they're either Mexican, Turkish, North Indian or Armenian (The Nightclub race).

I believe this is what Hakan recognized as "The Gold-chain Race".
Anyway I'll echo what most in the thread are already saying. Yes, you can self-improve in terms of looks, money, social skills, etc. but you will never self-improve into a "normie" because your idea of that no longer exists. The modern normal lifestyle is not a 2000s college movie with house parties, rock concerts, and hot girls it's staying home and "binge watching" terrible Netflix series with some SSRI goblin you met off of Tinder. I think the Sigma Grindset meme was partially a tongue-in-cheek acknowledgement of this. Being normal is no longer worth the effort so it's better to just "grind" towards money, fitness, and other quantifiable metrics of success.
#5
"Improvement" suggests standards and ideals. The term 'self-improvement' on the internet implies a very particular and narrow set of standards and ideals. Those of failed normalfaggots. This is pretty much the only standard within reach of the non-wealthy and it's a miserable one.
#6
Depends on what you count as "improvement."

Here's a little secret: the bar is so low, a lot of "failed normie" social enforcer types should be pestering and stepping on the ruin that is called normiedom now. It also depends on what you count as "hierarchy." Because they're, well, ruined, normie opinions are worth jack shit. Most of the people they put above them aren't normies and never were anyway.

But on the other hand this whole thing is very "american," this whole obsession with the discussion also. To me, the concept is very simple: get stronger so I can beat enemies to death with my bare hands, get more knowledgeable to create better stuff. That's all there is to it. Ascendance in the social hierarchy *requires* you not to be a normie, but to pretend to be one, and this process can be manipulated to hell and back. It requires certain character traits...
#7
"Self-improvement" is enough of a neologism that it's easy to see that it's fake and gay. The whole mindset is saccharine and reprehensible in my opinion (the 4chan screencap is correct). If you follow standard self-improvement steps you are likely to only torture yourself further. I have more respect for normies who just keep living their bug-lives rather than strive for meaningless social status, which they correctly identify is worthless in our age.

Most of the things you can do to genuinely become better have been infected by this self-help view, that you should do things for contentedness rather than for greatness. Bodybuilding was once exclusively something you did to actually become greater than you once were, although now it's tainted by a sort of egalitarian gay mindset that all exercise is equal, and that the practice of working out in itself is the important part. The important part is getting bigger muscles, looking better and becoming stronger. This kind of competition is basically socially unacceptable.

There are people who are just unsalvageable, like genuine pedophiles. There's no hope of this kind of person ever becoming anything worthwhile. Trannies and amarnites are not at all similar, in my opinion. Trannies are people with a specific kind of horrid fetish that dominates their entire life, much like pedos.
#8
Many of the responses to this thread feel like shadowboxing to me - devastating rebuttals of arguments that nobody has actually made. It's true that self-improvement advocates will often use language such as "fitting in" or "becoming normal", but this is just a surface impression. If you look at the substance of what they are saying, they don't care in the slightest about becoming a normie, though they generally want to be liked and respected by normies.

If I had to identify the distinguishing feature of the RW self-improvement mentality, I would point to a desire to heal oneself from the damage inflicted upon them by post-industrial civilization. They were denied the benefits of a rigorous education, so they're often interested in philosophy or the classics. They lift weights and obsess over diet because the modern lifestyle is inimical to good health. If they're drawn to PUA stuff, it's because their peers and elders never taught them how to associate with the opposite sex. And so forth. In general I think this sort of Self Improvement is a sensible ideal, and if it's often done in suboptimal or counterproductive ways, I don't see how that distinguishes it from any other activity.
#9
Everyone I've encountered who explicitly considered their "lifestyle" to be one of "self-improvement" was a devastatingly stupid failed normalfaggot. It's too consistent for me to believe it's anything but the underlying beliefs and assumptions of the thing. There are no good self-improvers.
#10
I think anyone with an explicit lifestyle is likely to be an insufferable faggot in general. Self improvement, at least what I consider the phrase to mean, is generally fun, either the process itself or the result, and therefore worth doing, it shouldn't however be done to try to fit into some idealized version of a normgroid, only to excel.
#11
'Self-help' is interesting because it's an inherently ambiguous term. What is the 'self' and what does it mean to help it? 'Self-help' has occasionally been a guise for the recrudescence of shamanistic and occult practices in modern society.

(wanted to attach an image but feature is unavailable)

Sometimes 'self-help' is the expression of an unconscious yearning for a higher kind of life, or even an aspiration to superhumanity.
#12
Anyone who tries to self-improve to fit in with the normies is stupid, and will fail, because they're kissing asses and brown nosing. As Anatoly Karlin said, "never cuck" - whenever a politician apologizes, his ratings go even further down. This is applicable to all social settings.

If you try to play nice with them, you'll never get anywhere. But step on them, fuck 'em over, griftmaxx, self improve as a tool to increase your abilities in pestering them - and they start liking you. See: Trump. Anything else results in the failed normie types, desperately trying to fit in, but always rejected. Done correctly, normies will beg for you to be with them, but you will be the one to not jump into that crab bucket in the first place.
#13
Yeah yeah normalfags suck. Anyway I agree with Guest and Saker, and I believe in the improover.


(05-13-2022, 05:44 AM)Svevlad Wrote: If you try to play nice with them, you'll never get anywhere. But step on them, fuck 'em over, griftmaxx, self improve as a tool to increase your abilities in pestering them - and they start liking you. See: Trump. Anything else results in the failed normie types, desperately trying to fit in, but always rejected. Done correctly, normies will beg for you to be with them, but you will be the one to not jump into that crab bucket in the first place.

How? this reads like pua advice that tells you girls will come to you if you ignore them. Actually they won't. And trying to fit in with normies will not fail. It will work easily if you care to try. No one has secret mind reading powers that tell them if someone is being genuine or 'just trying to fit in'. Unlike a politician all your previous statements are not recorded.
#14
(05-14-2022, 08:24 PM)Trep Wrote: Yeah yeah normalfags suck. Anyway I agree with Guest and Saker, and I believe in the improover.


(05-13-2022, 05:44 AM)Svevlad Wrote: If you try to play nice with them, you'll never get anywhere. But step on them, fuck 'em over, griftmaxx, self improve as a tool to increase your abilities in pestering them - and they start liking you. See: Trump. Anything else results in the failed normie types, desperately trying to fit in, but always rejected. Done correctly, normies will beg for you to be with them, but you will be the one to not jump into that crab bucket in the first place.

How? this reads like pua advice that tells you girls will come to you if you ignore them. Actually they won't. And trying to fit in with normies will not fail. It will work easily if you care to try. No one has secret mind reading powers that tell them if someone is being genuine or 'just trying to fit in'. Unlike a politician all your previous statements are not recorded.

It's easy to fit in with normies but you'll never actually BE a normie. Also, are you still on twitter?
#15
(05-15-2022, 12:16 AM)chungus Wrote: It's easy to fit in with normies but you'll never actually BE a normie. Also, are you still on twitter?
I guess a loner who gains a social circle of normies through calculated effort and determination will always have a possibly disturbing secret, and in that way differ. Still, if he acts like and associates with normies, and is similar enough to want to be like them, he is definitely pretty close.

And yes I am. My @ is the same as it's always been, who are you?
#16
This is a great thread. "Self-improvement" is something that I have striven for for a long time. Are there benefits to some of the more common suggestions? Absolutely. I generally feel and look better since I started lifting weights, plus going outside and getting sun is great advice. The COVID hysteria also got me into vitamins and supplements (a positive), plus my reading of RW social media finally convinced me to get off SSRIs, which I quit more or less cold turkey. (I should have never been prescribed them in the first place, although I readily admit major mental and personal turmoil 2016-2019.) All of these are good things.

However, self-improving towards becoming a normie is pointless. As stated here, there are no standards anymore, least of all standards worth achieving. Even deeper is the issue that self-improvement cannot fix the image of the self. A lot of our guys never fit in and will never fit in, so have internalized being an outcast. Similarly, a lot of Americans and Canadians are latchkey kids, and that lack of proper socialization often creates the duality of superior/inferiority complexes co-existing at the same time. Sun and steel do not fix those.
#17
(05-15-2022, 01:09 AM)Trep Wrote:
(05-15-2022, 12:16 AM)chungus Wrote: It's easy to fit in with normies but you'll never actually BE a normie. Also, are you still on twitter?
I guess a loner who gains a social circle of normies through calculated effort and determination will always have a possibly disturbing secret, and in that way differ. Still, if he acts like and associates with normies, and is similar enough to want to be like them, he is definitely pretty close.

And yes I am. My @ is the same as it's always been, who are you?

@bidenhyperborea
#18
People who get by comfortably on instinct and conventional wisdom have very different lives than people who can't and are forced to be deliberate and intentional with themselves and all of their choices. Someone in the latter set with enough self control and intelligence can probably train himself to be effortlessly sociable in a similar way that a pianist goes from rigorous technical exercise and study of harmony to free improvisation, but doing this just to fit in with Marvelball vaxhead normoids would of course be an enormous waste of energy and intellect. Someone capable of that would probably have higher motives anyway. 

Of course I'm not talking about self-education and diet/fitness here, which are unqualified positives regardless of motivation. On the other hand someone who "self improves" in these areas to fit in with normies will be frustrated because, as HH said above, that's a cargo cult mentality.
#19
(05-20-2022, 04:22 PM)ManletSupreme Wrote: Of course I'm not talking about self-education and diet/fitness here, which are unqualified positives regardless of motivation.

Are they? Logo and Kantbot are people who at least *think* they take their own self-education seriously. And diet/fitness lead to "health" brain, which can make you a faggot for life.
#20
It depends on person to person. Weak identity syndrome tards will always fuck it up and become annoying fags, because they always were annoying fags.


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