Trannies are Nietzscheans too.

[Striped_Pyjama_Boy_Nietzschean]

(Yes, the title is bait. Do please read on, nonetheless.)

Trannies are the real Nietzscheans.

We have all heard it. We know it is nonsense. But there is a lurking doubt: what of Paglia and Foucault's passion for Nietzsche? and all those homos in the early 20th century?

Wait... are not trannies a recent perversion which we can safely cordon off from Nietzsche?

There is one figure who provides the key to this debate: the Roman Emperor Heliogabalus (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elagabalus for those who do not know.)

This tranny's life is an exemplary example of will to power. The undoubtedly Nietzschean George Kreis were fascinated by him.

So, how to rescue Nietzsche from the trannies?

Trannydom is best seen as a localized maximum of dominance which consumes itself. The mental wreckage and neurosis, physically-damaging stress and general instability are its host's undoing. The shock to the world cannot overcome the shock to the system. As with ebola, the carrier does not last. The incredible psychic poison of trannyism exhausts itself.

We see that trannies (and fags) are Nietzscheans, but a weak and limited variety. (Sorry Zed.)

[Zed]

Increasingly - I'm starting to think you're part of an elaborate plot to get me 'physically removed' in the great Amarna tranny purge of 2023.

[Striped_Pyjama_Boy_Nietzschean]

Increasingly - I'm starting to think you're part of an elaborate plot to get me 'physically removed' in the great Amarna tranny purge of 2023.

I think this an interesting topic which all of us have something to say about. I am genuinely looking for Serious Discussion.

[The Green Groyper]

I think its fair to say such things as "self-overcoming" or Nietzche's vitriol at Christian-bourgeoise moral injunctions have been rhetorically useful for trannies. The very concept of "queerness" that is the constant destabilization of social and moral norms derives a lot of its power from Nietzche. After all I'm sure people have seen the libtard "gayroller has no breaks" meme. So there is however mangled a "will to power" embedded in faggots and their adjacent political movements.

I think its dishonest for Nietzcheans to claim Nietzche has not been useful for leftists and faggots. Even if they are correct in stating Nietzche was the opposite of any leftist.

Trying to argue "well uh those trannies weren't real Nietzcheans" comes off as a bit weak when its public record they did in fact read him and used his ideas accordingly.

[Guest]

I think its fair to say such things as "self-overcoming" or Nietzche's vitriol at Christian-bourgeoise moral injunctions have been rhetorically useful for trannies. The very concept of "queerness" that is the constant destabilization of social and moral norms derives a lot of its power from Nietzche. After all I'm sure people have seen the libtard "gayroller has no breaks" meme. So there is however mangled a "will to power" embedded in faggots and their adjacent political movements.

How does your mind even come to this conclusion? Ever heard of Marx, the guy who advocated for the abolishment of religion and the family? No, it’s not fair to say Nietzsche is the main philosopher for trannies when there is a large number of leftist philosophers whom they draw from. And before you claim that these leftist philosophers were inspired by Nietzsche, no they were not. The idea of the overman(elitism) conflicts with intersectionality.

[Guest]

(Yes, the title is bait. Do please read on, nonetheless.)

Trannies are the real Nietzscheans.

We have all heard it. We know it is nonsense. But there is a lurking doubt: what of Paglia and Foucault's passion for Nietzsche? and all those homos in the early 20th century?

Wait... are not trannies a recent perversion which we can safely cordon off from Nietzsche?

There is one figure who provides the key to this debate: the Roman Emperor Heliogabalus (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elagabalus for those who do not know.)

This tranny's life is an exemplary example of will to power. The undoubtedly Nietzschean George Kreis were fascinated by him.

So, how to rescue Nietzsche from the trannies?

Trannydom is best seen as a localized maximum of dominance which consumes itself. The mental wreckage and neurosis, physically-damaging stress and general instability are its host's undoing. The shock to the world cannot overcome the shock to the system. As with ebola, the carrier does not last. The incredible psychic poison of trannyism exhausts itself.

We see that trannies (and fags) are Nietzscheans, but a weak and limited variety. (Sorry Zed.)

 There is no “rescuing Nietzsche from the trannies” if they can’t “take it” in the first place. There is nothing Nietzschean about cutting your genitals off/ taking estrogen, you are giving into a sickness, a perversion that negates your most basic biological function (reproduction). Nietzsche was a somewhat sickly man, yet he chose to overcome this and was able to achieve much in spite of it. He did not give in to it or let it overcome him, but trannies do. They succumb to whatever physical or mental ailment that gives them the desire to castrate themselves, and subsequently expect unearned praise for it. The tranny does not overcome anything through will, they subside their will to what is a still unexplainable self-destructive desire. The tranny is not life-affirming, the tranny seeks to destroy life, to regress into infancy, to decay, and to pass on their parasite to a new host by grooming the next generation of faggots. ZED, the last thing your shriveled body will ever see is a halberd piercing into your man-tits.

[Guest]

This forum is not qualified to talk about NEET-CHE desu. Simply stick to "how do I get laid?" "how do I make money?" and "I hate those twatter people!"

[Handi]

I've only read BGE so forgive me if there are pieces that I'm missing. My understanding of Nietzsche's morality is that it's grounded in reference to certain kinds of material outcomes and not a wholly autonomous creation of the self. For example, he praises early-stage aristocrats, i.e. violent warriors, for being "more complete animals" (paraphrased) than the modern man.

In a tenuous sense you could argue that the masses of Last Men exert domination over their surroundings, but this is a reach because they have to deny their instincts and give up their animal individuality in order to take part in this abstract, socially mediated longhouse form of dominance. It's a devil's pact in which the bugman gives up something even more valuable in order to retain a shrieking, neurotic semblance of security and an inverted form of control.

Likewise, you wouldn't be able to say that the nagging mother-in-law or schoolmarm are Nietzschean figures. Browbeating and haranguing others via social channels is a diminished expression of will-to-power, and at the end of the day it only works to the extend that their counterparties go along with it. These types of people can only assert themselves in sheer numbers and whatever impact they have as a group, they totally lack the ability to decide values in accordance with their own individual instinct and impose this decision upon their environment.

Trannies fall into this latter category. As above, you could say the tranny "troonvaluates" values according to his own will; technically he follows a path that is self-created rather than received, literally as deep as their bones (which future archaelogists will identify as those of a man). But this is a narrow and shallow conception for at least two reasons:

Firstly, trannies lack the ability to autonomously impose the result of their self-defined values onto the world. The greater warrior strikes down his opponent, but the tranny can't compel you to think of it as a woman and want to fuck it etc. What they can do instead is act in concert as a special interest group and manipulate sympathetic governments/social groups into ruining your life for not paying lip service to their disgusting roleplay, and what is this if not the characteristic behavior of the longhouse and the anemic last man? Ultimately, none of these groups would have any power over the physical world if not for subverted and brainwashed police officers who are mentally castrated from a young age and selectively let off the leash to do the real work of domination against "hate criminals" and so forth.

Trannydom is best seen as a localized maximum of dominance which consumes itself. The mental wreckage and neurosis, physically-damaging stress and general instability are its host's undoing. The shock to the world cannot overcome the shock to the system. As with ebola, the carrier does not last. The incredible psychic poison of trannyism exhausts itself.

This is correct and I would say even more fundamentally why troonvaluation is not Nietzschean. Even if trannies could successfully impose their will on others, it's a will that completely negates their animal being. When the warrior exerts his will which is in accordance with instinct he stands to acquire physical strength, plunder and treasure, women, and so forth. For the individual, victory begets more victory, and constant struggle refines the race to be stronger, taller, more intelligent, more cooperative, and more beautiful. These are the good material outcomes I mentioned at the beginning that Nietzsche uses to justify his sense of morality, and they have a self-stabilizing quality.

But in the case of trannies, the tranny's will-to-power leads him precisely away from these goods. Achieving his goals leads him to become a physical and spiritual contradiction: weaker and more decrepit, nauseating at a glance, with a mind warped further by exogenous female hormones and genitals mutilated into a perpetually open wound. Like other faggots, troons are always gleefully deceitful backstabbers who delight in spoiling the camaraderie of better men simply because they can, no männerbund can function as a coherent unit with such a creature within its ranks. Success is so hostile to troonvaluation of morals that the only reason they even pose a problem is the enabling spiritual weakness of a vast and undirected mass of more functional normies. No healthy tribe/nation would nor has tolerated the existence of trannies. They are even more Last Man than the last men contemporary to Nietzsche.

Elagabalus stoked the animus of Roman elites and the Praetorian Guard through his perceptibly foreign conduct and his religious provocations.

No shit. 

Trying to argue "well uh those trannies weren't real Nietzcheans" comes off as a bit weak when its public record they did in fact read him and used his ideas accordingly.

From the part I've read, and leaning on what others have said about how confusing his other writing can be, I think Nietzschean morality is rather unclearly defined/explained and this leaves it open to being reduced to "doing whatever I want because I feel like it." This is an obvious point of subversion. I think that due to his atheism, Nietzsche's appeals to spirit are more or less contingent on observing material outcomes of life in beautiful, violent conflict, and thus are circular. For contrast, religious morals have an outside reference to their origin with material proofing (by their fruits ye shall know them) which makes them somewhat harder to subvert. Anything can be subverted with ill intent, but Nietzschean philosophy is an abstract thing that can't be compressed down to clear commands from God, AND if you're squinting it just so happens to look a lot like "doing whatever I want because I feel like it." He really ought to have seen it coming that this would be abused, but it's not a genuine application of his ideas.

[Ricky23]

I think its fair to say such things as "self-overcoming" or Nietzche's vitriol at Christian-bourgeoise moral injunctions have been rhetorically useful for trannies. The very concept of "queerness" that is the constant destabilization of social and moral norms derives a lot of its power from Nietzche. After all I'm sure people have seen the libtard "gayroller has no breaks" meme. So there is however mangled a "will to power" embedded in faggots and their adjacent political movements.

I think its dishonest for Nietzcheans to claim Nietzche has not been useful for leftists and faggots. Even if they are correct in stating Nietzche was the opposite of any leftist.

Trying to argue "well uh those trannies weren't real Nietzcheans" comes off as a bit weak when its public record they did in fact read him and used his ideas accordingly.

Generally I have been sympathetic to your criticisms of Nietzsche, but this is pretty blatantly guilt by association. 
They aren't real Nietzcheans because they didn't believe things which are vital to his philosophy. For example: 
"But the awakened one, the knowing own, saith: "Body am I entirely and nothing more; and soul is only the name of something in the body." 
Very evidently primacy is being placed on the "body" which means the inherited passions and instincts of the specimen that are entirely unconscious. The ego exists only to prevent these often contradictory passions from manifesting in inexpedient or self destructive ways. 
In this system there is no basis for self-mutilation in the service of sexual gratification, that seems exactly contrary to what he's saying. Transgenderism is a body despising set of ideas intended to justify the destruction of the body for licentious purposes, this is the same reason for the tendency of trannies to groom adolescents, because they are gratified by the destruction of the body and squandering of potential.

[Chud]

We have this thread every hour.

[The Green Groyper]

I think its fair to say such things as "self-overcoming" or Nietzche's vitriol at Christian-bourgeoise moral injunctions have been rhetorically useful for trannies. The very concept of "queerness" that is the constant destabilization of social and moral norms derives a lot of its power from Nietzche. After all I'm sure people have seen the libtard "gayroller has no breaks" meme. So there is however mangled a "will to power" embedded in faggots and their adjacent political movements.

I think its dishonest for Nietzcheans to claim Nietzche has not been useful for leftists and faggots. Even if they are correct in stating Nietzche was the opposite of any leftist.

Trying to argue "well uh those trannies weren't real Nietzcheans" comes off as a bit weak when its public record they did in fact read him and used his ideas accordingly.

Generally I have been sympathetic to your criticisms of Nietzsche, but this is pretty blatantly guilt by association. 
They aren't real Nietzcheans because they didn't believe things which are vital to his philosophy. For example: 
"But the awakened one, the knowing own, saith: "Body am I entirely and nothing more; and soul is only the name of something in the body." 
Very evidently primacy is being placed on the "body" which means the inherited passions and instincts of the specimen that are entirely unconscious. The ego exists only to prevent these often contradictory passions from manifesting in inexpedient or self destructive ways. 
In this system there is no basis for self-mutilation in the service of sexual gratification, that seems exactly contrary to what he's saying. Transgenderism is a body despising set of ideas intended to justify the destruction of the body for licentious purposes, this is the same reason for the tendency of trannies to groom adolescents, because they are gratified by the destruction of the body and squandering of potential.

Ah but then trannies claim they were born in the "wrong body" or that their authentic identity or ego is imprisoned in a body that does not suit them. With the justification being that achieving self actualization and power over one's maladies or discontents comes from changing or escaping this prison of unwanted flesh.

A tranny would probably respond to you by saying their instincts/subconscious are in line with their "true" identity, with only the rationalizing super ego and social sanction holding it back.

I don't agree obviously, but their arguments are made in this way.

I think its fair to say such things as "self-overcoming" or Nietzche's vitriol at Christian-bourgeoise moral injunctions have been rhetorically useful for trannies. The very concept of "queerness" that is the constant destabilization of social and moral norms derives a lot of its power from Nietzche. After all I'm sure people have seen the libtard "gayroller has no breaks" meme. So there is however mangled a "will to power" embedded in faggots and their adjacent political movements.

How does your mind even come to this conclusion? Ever heard of Marx, the guy who advocated for the abolishment of religion and the family? No, it’s not fair to say Nietzsche is the main philosopher for trannies when there is a large number of leftist philosophers whom they draw from. And before you claim that these leftist philosophers were inspired by Nietzsche, no they were not. The idea of the overman(elitism) conflicts with intersectionality.

Foucalt, Freud and Deleuze were all leftists-and they all took inspiration from Nietzche.

[Striped_Pyjama_Boy_Nietzschean]

We have this thread every hour.

I have not seen another thread that was strictly about trannies and Nietzsche, despite the infamous quotation I open with.

Handi's good post above has been worth it alone.

[Ricky23]

Ah but then trannies claim they were born in the "wrong body" or that their authentic identity or ego is imprisoned in a body that does not suit them. With the justification being that achieving self actualization and power over one's maladies or discontents comes from changing or escaping this prison of unwanted flesh.

A tranny would probably respond to you by saying their instincts/subconscious are in line with their "true" identity, with only the rationalizing super ego and social sanction holding it back.

I don't agree obviously, but their arguments are made in this way.

That argument ignores the entire philosophy, if your ego is justifying the destruction of the body it is justifying the destruction of its own potential and is negating its own 'will'. The will is the set of inherited instincts, any obstruction to it goes against the will to power. Nietzsche advocates for the full expression of the will without any 'chafing' or destructive manifestations of contrary instincts, obviously this is impossible under the current human *condition* hence the overman. Transgenderism is a sexual instinct which chafes against all other aspects of the body and thus giving full expression to it exclusively and at the detriment of other instincts will result in the destruction of the will and therefore potential.
Here's another quote regarding the expression of certian instinct at the detriment of others:
"That is an ear! An ear as big as a man!" I looked still more attentively- and actually there did move under the ear something that was pitiably small and poor and slim. And in truth this immense ear was perched on a small thin stalk- the stalk, however, was a man! A person putting a glass to his eyes, could even recognize further a small envious countenance, and also that a bloated little soul dangled at the stalk. The people told me, however, that the big ear was not only a man, but a great man, a genius. But I never believed in the people when they spoke of great men- and I hold to my belief that it was a reversed cripple, who had too little of everything, and too much of one thing."

[Zed]

Nietzsche advocates for the full expression of the will without any 'chafing' or destructive manifestations of contrary instincts, obviously this is impossible under the current human *condition* hence the overman. Transgenderism is a sexual instinct which chafes against all other aspects of the body and thus giving full express."

This is just incorrect.

Nietzsche advocates for the full expression of will even onto death. Even onto self-annihilation. 

Put differently - why did Zarathustra both esteem and love the down-goers?

What is great in man is that he is a bridge and not a goal: what is lovable in man is that he is an over-going and a down-going.

[Image: https://64.media.tumblr.com/b6982f678652...20f96a.jpg]

I'll pose my answer as another question: What would the above image mean in the context of Nietzschean philosophy?

[Ricky23]

This is just incorrect.

Nietzsche advocates for the full expression of will even onto death. Even onto self-annihilation. 

Put differently - why did Zarathustra both esteem and love the down-goers?

What is great in man is that he is a bridge and not a goal: what is lovable in man is that he is an over-going and a down-going.

[Image: https://64.media.tumblr.com/b6982f678652...20f96a.jpg]

I'll pose my answer as another question: What would the above image mean in the context of Nietzschean philosophy?

Just to be clear I don't disagree with what you are saying, when I say "destructive manifestations of contrary instincts" I am not literally talking about your life but rather that they hamper the manifestations of other instincts or express themselves in a way which destroys your progress. For instance everytime I see a truck drive past me I have an instinct to jump in front of it but I don't because it isn't expedient. Would jumping in front of the truck be "will unto death"?

[Zed]

Just to be clear I don't disagree with what you are saying, when I say "destructive manifestations of contrary instincts" I am not literally talking about your life but rather that they hamper the manifestations of other instincts or express themselves in a way which destroys your progress. For instance everytime I see a truck drive past me I have an instinct to jump in front of it but I don't because it isn't expedient. Would jumping in front of the truck be "will unto death"?

My instincts are never fully knowable to me. Are they to you? They emerge when they do, and I act accordingly. I conceive of myself as a rather cold person relative to others, but in rare moments - things can incite me to tremendous sadness or rage. With that comes a compulsion to act or perhaps to retreat from the world.

My desires I understand more clearly.

I do not desire either women, or children of my own.

The only desire that ever counterbalanced my desire to transition was shame. Say a desire to not be seen as an abomination. But that shame existed in tandem with a tendency to despise the vast majority of humanity. How could I be continue preoccupied with the judgements of those I disdained? There was no harmony in that and together they were crippling. Which then to let go if? My overwhelming disdain for humanity, and thus an acceptance of the repression. Or - alternatively - to let go of the shame, and embrace the part of me that was capable of such overwhelming hatred - and thus (in turn) of love. 

I desire other things of course - Wealth, power, and the ability to exert my influence on those around me. I desire to create art, to build things, and to have the resources to assist others in projects of their own creation. Are those compromised by the one desire? Truly, it cuts in both directions. 

I adore Nietzsche, because I adore Amor Fati. If the Guest above was granted his fantasy of gutting me with a halberd, I suspect he would see a smile on my face in the end. I try my best to live under the assumption that I could always die tomorrow. I leave you with quote from another tranny - one who died at 29 as her body was rendered cancer-ridden by literal horse-piss hormones she injected herself with:

By the time you read this I will be gone,

....

Unfortunately before my death I had no desire left for life . . . I am just so bored by everything. You might say bored to death. (D)id you know I couldn't last. I always knew it. I wish I could meet you all again.

I wish, in the end, to be able to say that with a smile.

[Ricky23]

My instincts are never fully knowable to me. Are they to you? They emerge when they do, and I act accordingly. I conceive of myself as a rather cold person relative to others, but in rare moments - things can incite me to tremendous sadness or rage. With that comes a compulsion to act or perhaps to retreat from the world.

My desires I understand more clearly.

I do not desire either women, or children of my own.

The only desire that ever counterbalanced my desire to transition was shame. Say a desire to not be seen as an abomination. But that shame existed in tandem with a tendency to despise the vast majority of humanity. How could I be continue preoccupied with the judgements of those I disdained? There was no harmony in that and together they were crippling. Which then to let go if? My overwhelming disdain for humanity, and thus an acceptance of the repression. Or - alternatively - to let go of the shame, and embrace the part of me that was capable of such overwhelming hatred - and thus (in turn) of love. 

I desire other things of course - Wealth, power, and the ability to exert my influence on those around me. I desire to create art, to build things, and to have the resources to assist others in projects of their own creation. Are those compromised by the one desire? Truly, it cuts in both directions. 

I adore Nietzsche, because I adore Amor Fati. If the Guest above was granted his fantasy of gutting me with a halberd, I suspect he would see a smile on my face in the end. I try my best to live under the assumption that I could always die tomorrow. I leave you with quote from another tranny - one who died at 29 as her body was rendered cancer-ridden by literal horse-piss hormones she injected herself with:

By the time you read this I will be gone,

....

Unfortunately before my death I had no desire left for life . . . I am just so bored by everything. You might say bored to death. (D)id you know I couldn't last. I always knew it. I wish I could meet you all again.

I wish, in the end, to be able to say that with a smile.

I really hate you and reading your messages makes me light headed. Genital mutilation is not some coy artifact of a fatalist disposition, you aren't living a poetic life analogous to Achilles. You are disgusting and you know it
No your instincts are not conscious and you will have an instinct to have children and a wife etc you have simply had it co-opted by a meme. It's a meme which infected you because you were already afflicted by contrary instincts, your body's form is an instinct as such and one which is prior to all others, so there are already two instincts in conflict. You have gone to war against yourself because you are broken and feel like you are unable to assert that warring externally. This springs from weakness.
Does depriving yourself of physical strength augment your feeling of power?
Or succumbing to insecurity about your body?
Or shaving your bones?
Or ridding yourself of any manly charms in exchange for nothing?
Dysphoria = despising of the body.
"Even in your folly and despising ye serve your Self, ye despiser of the body. I tell you, your very Self wanteth to die, and turneth away from life."

[Zed]

...

I think it is good to be unsettled in such ways. Glad to have had that effect.

As for the rest: I don't endorse SRS. It is ugly and offensive to me. Nor do I have dysphoria anymore. It served me for a time, and when I no longer needed it - I discarded it. I choose to be what I am because I desire it, and for no other reason. For the most part, you are posting against a strawtroon.

Does depriving yourself of physical strength augment your feeling of power?

"It's more fun this way." 

More seriously: There is a reason I have a concealed carry and advise other trannies to have one too. One adapts.

Or shaving your bones?

The only tragedy is that I was born a hundred years too early to replace them with metal and cybernetics. Wouldn't it be nice to be an iron man?


[Image: https://m.media-amazon.com/images/M/MV5B...@._V1_.jpg]

'Our Love Will Turn This Whole Fucking World to Rust'

Dysphoria = despising of the body

You're right, at least on this. I would rather trannies transition out of raw sexual perversion than self-hatred. But beyond both, there are syntheses of values without the tension.

[Ricky23]

You're right, at least on this. I would rather trannies transition out of raw sexual perversion than self-hatred. But beyond both, there are syntheses of values without the tension.

What does transitioning mean then?
And I still don't see how this gets arround what nietzsche says in 'of redemption' from tsz regarding the over development of certian proclivities at the expense of others.

[Kikerobatty]

Nor do I have dysphoria anymore.

"..."

More proof that Zed only hates guests because they're the only one who don't treat his tranimal tendencies with the hatred they deserve? Ricky is trying to argue a troon out of retardation, an impossible feat. Guests understand that the only thing Zed should have is death.