Video Game General

[ꦈꦒꦲꦸꦫꦲꦺꦴꦗ꦳ꦲ]

Natsuiro High School: Seishun Hakusho

Summertime High School: A Young Man's Notes—How a New Exchange Student Like Myself Ran Into His Childhood Friend on the School Tour, Then for Some Reason Became Super-Popular with the Girls for His Daily Scoops on the School Photography Club Even Though He Only Takes Panty Shots, and What He Thinks as He Goes on Dates During His Summer of Island School Life.

[kirukuni]

Natsuiro High School: Seishun Hakusho

Summertime High School: A Young Man's Notes—How a New Exchange Student Like Myself Ran Into His Childhood Friend on the School Tour, Then for Some Reason Became Super-Popular with the Girls for His Daily Scoops on the School Photography Club Even Though He Only Takes Panty Shots, and What He Thinks as He Goes on Dates During His Summer of Island School Life.

Have you ever read any interviews from that dev? He was inspired by GTA, but didn't want any niggers and replaced gun fights with panty shots of small girls. He's an enlightened man.

[BillyONare]

Cuphead actually fun to play or do people just pretend to like it because they have fake nostalgia for old animation?

It is genuinely fun and well animated. My only critiques are that it’s not very difficult and it is mostly boss battles.

Arcade games of the past required you to play well for an extended period of time, say 30 minutes to an hour, and if you lost all of your lives you had to go back to the beginning. This required not only dexterity, but consistency and focus, so it was much more satisfying to overcome the challenge. This took luck mostly out of the equation so you knew that it was all down to your skills rather than hitting the retry button 500 times indie style. In indie fag cripple “hard” games there are essentially checkpoints every two minutes, or 30 seconds in the case of an abortion like Celeste or Super Meatboy. Cuphead is like this so you don’t get very much satisfaction for beating the fake difficult fights even if they take a few tries.

While the bosses are very inventive and aesthetically interesting, you do lose something when you’re stuck in a room fighting something vs. a more well balanced game that includes traversing a level, fighting lots of small enemies, etc.

You should still play it though; it is cool.

[Guest]

What the hell are you saying? For one you're acting like western and eastern games are the same scene, AAA or Indie. Indie especially I'd say there's the widest distance between them. Cave Story is a doujin game. Japanese PC games didn't come into being when the western internet learned about them. It's a very rich tradition which has frankly blown western "indies" out of the water from the very start.

If you mean the western indies of the late 000s and early 10s, that was a hellish time. What could you possibly like from the period? I only remember Hotline Miami and Cry of Fear, because that's Europeans just about doing the doujin game thing. The solidified and self identifying "indie scene" was always a disgusting dumpster fire fueled by pure racism ("we want games that aren't about bald space marines no we will not play those chink yellow monkey fuck japanese games you fucking bastard, fuck your mother. Zoe Quinn invented games which aren't about shooting.")

Can't really get to the other points, but the idea that there is a huge difference between Japanese indie and American indie is somewhat silly. Yes, Japan got to it first, but the precepts of early Western indie and Japanese indie are essentially the same; rigid structure and well thought out gameplay ideas that fit into a similar framework. You could argue that American meme indie (Goat Simulator et al.) is different from Japindie, but I'm talking about a specific indie scene that existed from around 2004-2013. You are right in that Zoe Quinn both spiritually (in creating Depression Quest) and physically (Alec Holowka) killed this scene, but it's totally untrue that she was the dominant force. E.Y.E, Hotline Miami (as you mentioned), Super Meat Boy, Gunpoint, and hell, even Fez (as much as it's creator is a retarded nigger), are games with very strict, well defined visions which innovated in their genres heavily, that match Cave Story and other Japanese games. Just because everyone involved was a faggot doesn't really mean the products were bad; you could say pretty much the same thing about the musical indie scene, honestly.

[Guest]

Admittedly, the notion that the American indie scene was a very intelligent place with great developers does somewhat come crashing down when you realize that they seriously thought fucking Braid was a good game, but the point remains.

[anthony]

What the hell are you saying? For one you're acting like western and eastern games are the same scene, AAA or Indie. Indie especially I'd say there's the widest distance between them. Cave Story is a doujin game. Japanese PC games didn't come into being when the western internet learned about them. It's a very rich tradition which has frankly blown western "indies" out of the water from the very start.

If you mean the western indies of the late 000s and early 10s, that was a hellish time. What could you possibly like from the period? I only remember Hotline Miami and Cry of Fear, because that's Europeans just about doing the doujin game thing. The solidified and self identifying "indie scene" was always a disgusting dumpster fire fueled by pure racism ("we want games that aren't about bald space marines no we will not play those chink yellow monkey fuck japanese games you fucking bastard, fuck your mother. Zoe Quinn invented games which aren't about shooting.")

Can't really get to the other points, but the idea that there is a huge difference between Japanese indie and American indie is somewhat silly. Yes, Japan got to it first, but the precepts of early Western indie and Japanese indie are essentially the same; rigid structure and well thought out gameplay ideas that fit into a similar framework. You could argue that American meme indie (Goat Simulator et al.) is different from Japindie, but I'm talking about a specific indie scene that existed from around 2004-2013. You are right in that Zoe Quinn both spiritually (in creating Depression Quest) and physically (Alec Holowka) killed this scene, but it's totally untrue that she was the dominant force. E.Y.E, Hotline Miami (as you mentioned), Super Meat Boy, Gunpoint, and hell, even Fez (as much as it's creator is a retarded nigger), are games with very strict, well defined visions which innovated in their genres heavily, that match Cave Story and other Japanese games. Just because everyone involved was a faggot doesn't really mean the products were bad; you could say pretty much the same thing about the musical indie scene, honestly.

My point I wanted to make, which may not have come out too clearly, is that American (kind of western but mostly talking American) indie "scene" was more like an idea or aesthetic. A direction in which to make games. The fact they were "indie" was incidental and temporary. Pauline Kael wrote basically the same thing about "indie" filmmaking in America. That that whole crowd had no interest in good films made efficiently and personally. They wanted a new rougher kind of film. Which was only incidentally poor and independent.  I would also say that in both cases the indies won and the true spirit of their work, which was communism, has won. All American games are 2000s indies now. Hollywood became that style of indie, and then evolved beyond into pure funwaa hell, just like video games are doing.

And the other half of the thing, in Japan people just did cool things themselves in the line of their already established doujin tradition. Games are cool, why not try your own? It's not a means of fighting culture, which is perceived as this impersonal force from above, it's a means of participating in a living one. American indies are always driven by this ugly, resenting, fighting disposition. Japanese "indies" feel like they were made by people who love normal Japanese video games. Like all doujin works. It's cottage industry expansion of the big living mainstream thing. While in the west it's guerrilla war against it. And like all communist guerrilla wars it's actually sponsored by the American Establishment all along.

[Guest]

What the hell are you saying? For one you're acting like western and eastern games are the same scene, AAA or Indie. Indie especially I'd say there's the widest distance between them. Cave Story is a doujin game. Japanese PC games didn't come into being when the western internet learned about them. It's a very rich tradition which has frankly blown western "indies" out of the water from the very start.

If you mean the western indies of the late 000s and early 10s, that was a hellish time. What could you possibly like from the period? I only remember Hotline Miami and Cry of Fear, because that's Europeans just about doing the doujin game thing. The solidified and self identifying "indie scene" was always a disgusting dumpster fire fueled by pure racism ("we want games that aren't about bald space marines no we will not play those chink yellow monkey fuck japanese games you fucking bastard, fuck your mother. Zoe Quinn invented games which aren't about shooting.")

Can't really get to the other points, but the idea that there is a huge difference between Japanese indie and American indie is somewhat silly. Yes, Japan got to it first, but the precepts of early Western indie and Japanese indie are essentially the same; rigid structure and well thought out gameplay ideas that fit into a similar framework. You could argue that American meme indie (Goat Simulator et al.) is different from Japindie, but I'm talking about a specific indie scene that existed from around 2004-2013. You are right in that Zoe Quinn both spiritually (in creating Depression Quest) and physically (Alec Holowka) killed this scene, but it's totally untrue that she was the dominant force. E.Y.E, Hotline Miami (as you mentioned), Super Meat Boy, Gunpoint, and hell, even Fez (as much as it's creator is a retarded nigger), are games with very strict, well defined visions which innovated in their genres heavily, that match Cave Story and other Japanese games. Just because everyone involved was a faggot doesn't really mean the products were bad; you could say pretty much the same thing about the musical indie scene, honestly.

My point I wanted to make, which may not have come out too clearly, is that American (kind of western but mostly talking American) indie "scene" was more like an idea or aesthetic. A direction in which to make games. The fact they were "indie" was incidental and temporary. Pauline Kael wrote basically the same thing about "indie" filmmaking in America. That that whole crowd had no interest in good films made efficiently and personally. They wanted a new rougher kind of film. Which was only incidentally poor and independent.  I would also say that in both cases the indies won and the true spirit of their work, which was communism, has won. All American games are 2000s indies now. Hollywood became that style of indie, and then evolved beyond into pure funwaa hell, just like video games are doing.

And the other half of the thing, in Japan people just did cool things themselves in the line of their already established doujin tradition. Games are cool, why not try your own? It's not a means of fighting culture, which is perceived as this impersonal force from above, it's a means of participating in a living one. American indies are always driven by this ugly, resenting, fighting disposition. Japanese "indies" feel like they were made by people who love normal Japanese video games. Like all doujin works. It's cottage industry expansion of the big living mainstream thing. While in the west it's guerrilla war against it. And like all communist guerrilla wars it's actually sponsored by the American Establishment all along.

I will agree with this, in the sense that the worse impulses of indie won out over the better ones due to coordinated campaigns by niggers, feminists and jews to promote "art games" that absolutely destroyed the scene, but I disagree with this idea that American indie was always driven by the Pink Flamingoes impulse of hatred of beauty. You can look at Newgrounds games like Alien Hominid, Dustforce, Hacknet (which was probably one of the last hurrahs of old indie) etc. to see that so many indie devs cared deeply about making games that were fun, that rejected the dusty nihilism of a lot of 00s culture. People made games because they enjoyed it, not because they had to spread the gospel of GNC to young white men. Maybe there was something in those founding impulses that was the reason of indies eventual death to SJW faggotry, but I think there was a purity of heart in a lot of the devs involved.

[anthony]

I will agree with this, in the sense that the worse impulses of indie won out over the better ones due to coordinated campaigns by niggers, feminists and jews to promote "art games" that absolutely destroyed the scene, but I disagree with this idea that American indie was always driven by the Pink Flamingoes impulse of hatred of beauty. You can look at Newgrounds games like Alien Hominid, Dustforce, Hacknet (which was probably one of the last hurrahs of old indie) etc. to see that so many indie devs cared deeply about making games that were fun, that rejected the dusty nihilism of a lot of 00s culture. People made games because they enjoyed it, not because they had to spread the gospel of GNC to young white men. Maybe there was something in those founding impulses that was the reason of indies eventual death to SJW faggotry, but I think there was a purity of heart in a lot of the devs involved.

I was actually just going to make another post about how flash games were the western doujin scene and the authentic expression of what normal people outside the industry proper were interested in. And if you remember, it was all cool edgy nu-metal stuff. It was Madness Combat. It wasn't all shooting, but none of it was communist. Again, "indie" was a subculture, not the state of independence. Really we should be hammering this point hard. It's like a handful of insane Jews calling themselves "Bolsheviks", which I will remind you all meant "Majority". By claiming "Indie" these people were declaring themselves the voice of all outside the machine. It was a really awful and evil thing and they got away with it.

[oyakodon_khan]

Dunkey is a retard. But at least his video essays are less than 10 minutes long and well edited. If you make a two hours long video explaining why "Fallout New Vegas is good actually" You should be a test subject for new forms of torture previously unthinkable with medieval technology. These videos only exist for people that don't play video games to feel like they have played them.

[chevalier]

These videos only exist for people that don't play video games to feel like they have played them.

That was my exact impression of that ridiculous 12 hour video about TES: Oblivion. A way for people to "play" (or "re-play") the game while not having to actually do so. I know some people who have never read Berserk, but consider themselves fans of it because they had a long video describing the story playing in the background while they did something else.

[BillyONare]

Do people really do that? How can they not feel embarrassed?

[anthony]

These videos only exist for people that don't play video games to feel like they have played them.

Or we could say they are... remembering it so you don't have to...



Doug won. It's his internet. All of youtube is just variations on the Dougvania genre with Rolfelike characteristics.

[BillyONare]

soft seinen dunkeycalm

[Recent Friend]

Top Drunkee Shooter

[oyakodon_khan]

I suggested they call the new Mortal Kombat game "Mortal Kombat 1" at a business meeting and they actually thought I was serious and went through with it.
Fucking retards.

[PIGSAW]

Natsuiro High School: Seishun Hakusho

Summertime High School: A Young Man's Notes—How a New Exchange Student Like Myself Ran Into His Childhood Friend on the School Tour, Then for Some Reason Became Super-Popular with the Girls for His Daily Scoops on the School Photography Club Even Though He Only Takes Panty Shots, and What He Thinks as He Goes on Dates During His Summer of Island School Life.

Have you ever read any interviews from that dev? He was inspired by GTA, but didn't want any niggers and replaced gun fights with panty shots of small girls. He's an enlightened man.

Wanted to pop in and say how cool this is. Did not know, will be buying now (though the name alone would've been day1 had I known earlier).

My point I wanted to make, which may not have come out too clearly, is that American (kind of western but mostly talking American) indie "scene" was more like an idea or aesthetic. A direction in which to make games. The fact they were "indie" was incidental and temporary. [...]

Please use the Vampire Name and call it what it is:





TIGSource - Super Meat Boy, Fez, Braid.. even good game Hotline Miami all emerged from TIGSource.

The "moustache" Millennial (they're Xennials but people don't understand there's a massive cultural divide between '80s and '90s births, TIGSource is all '80s babies which is why they have the twee obsession with '80s schlock) faggot "hipster" (not real hipsters 'cause they're not actually contrarian to fagciety, except for Cactus and some of the games that never made it) hive.

[...] Can't really get to the other points, but the idea that there is a huge difference between Japanese indie and American indie is somewhat silly. Yes, Japan got to it first, but the precepts of early Western indie and Japanese indie are essentially the same; [...]

Compare Japanese games from the '70s - '80s (I point here because I want to use the weakest era with the hardest technical limits, the most abstraction, and the least of a lead from Japan) against their western counterparts— the difference is comical.

Furthermore, make the same statement about animation and watch it fall apart:



This was Japanese animation in 1987, you can look here to compare it to what everyone else was doing the same year: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_an...ms_of_1987

The west simply took longer to grasp what "video games" are or could be due to the abstract nature of gaming as a medium.

This is not at all to say there are no good western games— it's to point out the disparity of them being so rare and abnormal while being so critically acclaimed (what the west is good at making are SYSTEMS: like DOOM, Unreal, and Source):



If even 20% of western efforts were as good as NARC, I might say they're equivalent to Japan.

As it stands, unfortunately the width of talent stateside and abroad (even the theoretical reapplication of Hollywood types or etc. to) gaming has not been utilized (because they're absorbed into other industries (I'll make a relevant post on NEOTOKYO and pushBAK about this later) or suicide from demoralization), unlike Japan which affords more (there is always lost talent in this horrid world) of these people real opportunities (although ZOG POZ coming in hot through Soyny, the now race traitor company is tryna pull the brakes on that).

Creatively, Japan has no real competitor (western gaming has traditionally relied on and been oriented around STEM due to it being seen as part of the technology sector through Silicon Valley on the west coast, why physics systems and etc. are all American and why Half-Life is about a scientist).

Where are the equivalent works from Germany, Italy, Spain?

Okay, Scotland gave us Rockstar.. so that counts for a lot, but nothing else— so the only country I can really point to is Sweden:

Team Psykskallar (ruMpel):





Dennaton Games:





Those were mentioned already though, how about Starbreeze:









But what, 3 companies? That's kind of pathetic when you compare the size of Japan vs their output.

I could point to France with Microïds' Syberia, Post Mortem, Still Life.. but then I'm almost just complimenting Sokal.. David Cage is interesting.. but he's an idiot, and it's all so French.
Technically, after America they should get the 2nd spot for how much they've done, but I'd prefer to give it to Sweden just for Wrong Number or Cry of Fear.

Issue being, the best western game developers that have ever existed (many of whom I interacted with and even watched develop) did so in the crevices of deviantART, Newgrounds, and especially Second Life (as well as the odd forum here and there)— this actually explains why Sweden pulls through, as Cactus and ruMpel share a background in modding as the best would-be game developers from the west are all modders. Because unlike in Japan, they have to do everything themselves for lack of infrastructure that helps them out. SUDA51 was able to join the game industry as a "writer" and create completely unique work by directing people more technically competent than he is, the American equivalent (I don't mean by output, but by circumstance) was Tim Schafer, but only because George Lucas used the military spending budget generated by Star Wars to open a path more similar to Japan— the modern version is shit like Hamburger Hepler (who was right in saying they should cut combat from Ass Effect, 'cause the combat in that fucking sucks) Quinn or any other niggered diversity welfare hire.

[...] I was actually just going to make another post about how flash games were the western doujin scene and the authentic expression of what normal people outside the industry proper were interested in. And if you remember, it was all cool edgy nu-metal stuff. It was Madness Combat. It wasn't all shooting, but none of it was communist. Again, "indie" was a subculture, not the state of independence. [...]

And much of that is unfortunately lost to time despite Fulp's perseverance with Newgrounds— I had extremely modded versions of the original Madness Interactive with hundreds of custom guns and shit from anime which I downloaded off of personal websites I'll never remember the names of (I'm sure not archived anyway).

Right, back on subject— what makes Japan better is simply the ratio (that's a byproduct of a functioning society). There is likely just as much talent in America (if not more, even if only due to population density) as there is in Japan, but it is not allowed to be used, except when the internet was freer, and these people could unchain themselves manually in the aforementioned places— this would be the good side (or use) of Anthony's later point about western indie games being like "guerrilla war".

[...] Zoe Quinn both spiritually (in creating Depression Quest) and physically (Alec Holowka) killed this scene, but it's totally untrue that she was the dominant force. E.Y.E, Hotline Miami (as you mentioned), Super Meat Boy, Gunpoint, and hell, even Fez (as much as it's creator is a retarded nigger), are games with very strict, well defined visions which innovated in their genres heavily, that match Cave Story and other Japanese games. [...]

I'm more than happy to blame fat, ugly, stupid egg-shaped slag poser Quinn for everything (and we all should, because it's funny):



But TIGSource was always a collection of loser faggots with the actual hipsters like Cactus a talented minority caught in there for lack of anywhere else to go (to get feedback or attention, outside of spamming your shit on 4trans like Notch did).

[...] Just because everyone involved was a faggot doesn't really mean the products were bad; you could say pretty much the same thing about the musical indie scene, honestly.

Hopefully we all know that "seperate art and artist" is completely farcical, as people are entirely capable of lying and as such many artists of weaker character will express the truth in their work and deny it with their words. So, I agree— only trust the work.

Admittedly, the notion that the American indie scene was a very intelligent place with great developers does somewhat come crashing down when you realize that they seriously thought fucking Braid was a good game, but the point remains.

While I find this negrolatrous video very funny, Blow actually isn't a moron— it's just that Braid was fucking stupid bait. The Witness was a much better effort and application of his interest in esoteric puzzle systems in games and making a Mystlike is far more honest than making a retarded version of Super Mario Bros. It's still mostly held back by his retarded aesthetic sense, but it's better than Braid (well, the parts of it that're actually 'designed', a lotta the shit looks like a fucking iPhone game).

[...] American indies are always driven by this ugly, resenting, fighting disposition. Japanese "indies" feel like they were made by people who love normal Japanese video games. Like all doujin works. It's cottage industry expansion of the big living mainstream thing. While in the west it's guerrilla war against it. And like all communist guerrilla wars it's actually sponsored by the American Establishment all along.

Good point, reminds me of the DT quote about how trying to date in America is a form of combat and that's why his quitter ass fucks Jungle Asian whores in the 3rd world. The culture of America for a long time has been far too combative, and it's why degenerative retards tend to win out. Leather skinned niggers (even if they wear the fairy faggot body of a longfaced antifa troon) can brute force their way into the arts where finer people will simply choose to leave when faced with needing to behave like their lessers to "win" something they should have as a birthright.

I will agree with this, in the sense that the worse impulses of indie won out over the better ones due to coordinated campaigns by niggers, feminists and jews to promote "art games" that absolutely destroyed the scene, [...]

What should happen with "indie" (and it's still on the table but we're most likely going to get a warped version of it since the only thing all the failures on the "right" produce is CRITICISM, yeah don't learn Japanese, it's called TRANSlation right? Let them do it! I'm sure nothing bad will come out of it) is for it to recapture/transform into the neo-AA market. The entire gaming industry was built by AA titles and the nostalgia for the PS2 era is really just nostalgia for a thriving AA industry. The likes of Dennaton, Team Psykskallar, Puppet Combo, Krinkels (now that he got into it via the success of Project Nexus 2), or anyone else good should not have to stay "indies" nor sell their sovl to AAA dogshit (ruMpel tried this and quit) NOR have to quit games altogether to work in Hollyweird (though pushBAK's contributions to Weta are easily their best).

[...] so many indie devs cared deeply about making games that were fun, that rejected the dusty nihilism of a lot of 00s culture. [...]

Now I have to make a fucking thread about "Hopepunk".

[oyakodon_khan]

Always been intrigued by "rare" games with a cult following. Should be a concept impossible to manifest in our digital era, yet games like Rule of Rose and Eternal Darkness are permanently on the brink of either getting a re-release, or being lost to the ether.

[BillyONare]

Super Meat Boy innovative vision…lawd have mercy…

[BillyONare]

Binding of Isaac is the Mona Lisa, Dustforce completed the system of German idealism, and Celeste is general artificial intelligence,

[BillyONare]

Mfw 10 year old amarnites fell for the TIGSource artfag propaganda and never reflected on it