The Path to Ultimate Power: How Do We Win?

[NuclearAbsolutist]

The west simply cannot tolerate alternate forms of government that put western cultural hegemony at risk.

I disagree firmly mainly as I do not see a alternate form of government being proposed. Deep down despite all the hot air you will hear, and all the proxy games played, with constant predictions of possible dark powers and dark acts every player sticks to the rules of the game laid down in 1945. We are in a situation of Europe in 1780s every regime is of the Ancient Regime and we are the Jacobin's but have no societies no networks not even real understanding is common let alone a government. And even with the apparent dislike of the two regimes and their sidekicks across the planet the powers that be in what we call the West are more than happy to wait it out for a few more decades for the other regimes to fold which many have done and lies as the chief fear of the remainder. As for culture-do you see anything out of China or Russia that is not equivalent to capeshit let alone a challenge to Hollywood?

[Guest]

China has to be economically obliterated. There is no future for either America or Europe elsewise.

The cost of a loss is a permanent balkanization into several Chinese client-states, with externally fomented civil strife and 'bilateral aid' utilized to render us the long term of equivalent of Iraq. Meanwhile, they will play to the side that cucks the most, switching allegiance between leftist/rightist factions the moment any seems too dominant or poses a threat to their interest. Our natural resources and land will be aggressively pillaged, our museums emptied and exported, and the permitted elite will retain the dignity of the average Arab/African oligarchy.

Yeah and America shouldn't have helped Germany in WW2 because Hitler was a brutal conqueror who would've turned the US into his lapdog. Can we dispense with the propaganda and fear mongering and discuss reality? The west falling is a long shot in the first place, and you want to theorize about China's role in this potential "fall of the empire" scenario?

[National Kid]

Yeah and America shouldn't have helped Germany in WW2 because Hitler was a brutal conqueror who would've turned the US into his lapdog. 

Words of Caution RE: Statements that could be Interpreted as Countersignalling the Fürher

[Guest]

I disagree firmly mainly as I do not see a alternate form of government being proposed. Deep down despite all the hot air you will hear, and all the proxy games played, with constant predictions of possible dark powers and dark acts every player sticks to the rules of the game laid down in 1945. We are in a situation of Europe in 1780s every regime is of the Ancient Regime and we are the Jacobin's but have no societies no networks not even real understanding is common let alone a government. And even with the apparent dislike of the two regimes and their sidekicks across the planet the powers that be in what we call the West are more than happy to wait it out for a few more decades for the other regimes to fold which many have done and lies as the chief fear of the remainder. As for culture-do you see anything out of China or Russia that is not equivalent to capeshit let alone a challenge to Hollywood?

The US has certainly escalated things with China with their Tiktok ban and the situation with semiconductors. This is on top of the ongoing investigation into human rights abuses. In my opinion the US wants open war, which is why they pushed into Ukraine, because they have internal issues themselves. War was what healed the US in the 40s and it will be needed to heal it again soon. They are trying to force their enemies to make the first move so the west has the advantage. It's a mutual race to the bottom. As for culture I honestly don't know much about the nations. I saw Best in Hell which was about Wagner PMC and it was very strong, reminding me of Natsoc Germany. Russia is staunchly Orthodox Christian as well, a very valuable cultural asset. As for China, they basically just import Hollywood so their culture is very questionable. But they understand the harm the western model poses and have taken a number of precautions, still there isn't much to be confident in. The CCP is a strong national socialist institution, which is good enough in my eyes but I understand others being hesitant. The first step to addressing cultural issues in my view is putting an end to western dominance. It's not like the DR has produced any stellar works as of late.

[Zed]

Yeah and America shouldn't have helped Germany in WW2 because Hitler was a brutal conqueror who would've turned the US into his lapdog. Can we dispense with the propaganda and fear mongering and discuss reality? The west falling is a long shot in the first place, and you want to theorize about China's role in this potential "fall of the empire" scenario?

I don't believe it is remotely a longshot, even if is not the most likely outcome. Systemic instability the financial system is high, as is political instability - climate change and supply line disruption will aggravate and worsen these factors. Aside from that, we are too tech dependent on both Taiwan and China. The west is currently in a dominant position and we do have a upper hand, but outside of Ukraine (which we've handled quite well) - the past twenty years of the war on terror offers a more grim picture of our capabilities.

Call me pessimistic, but if the USD ceases to be the world reserve currency, it is game-over. The resulting economic devastation will trigger a slow motion collapse-tier event in the US. China will either ensure that we balkanize (and castrate us in the long term), or ensure the instillation of a permanent pro-China oligarchy. 

The rest of what I said follows.

Hitler fought for the preservation of a multipolar world against the unipolar. The coming fight is for two separate visions of what a unipolar world looks like.

[Guest]

I don't believe it is remotely a longshot, even if is not the most likely outcome. Systemic instability the financial system is high, as is political instability - climate change and supply line disruption will aggravate and worsen these factors. Aside from that, we are too tech dependent on both Taiwan and China. The west is currently in a dominant position and we do have a upper hand, but outside of Ukraine (which we've handled quite well) - the past twenty years of the war on terror offers a more grim picture of our capabilities.

Call me pessimistic, but if the USD ceases to be the world reserve currency, it is game-over. The resulting economic devastation will trigger a slow motion collapse-tier event in the US. China will either ensure that we balkanize (and castrate us in the long term), or ensure the instillation of a permanent pro-China oligarchy. 

The rest of what I said follows.

Hitler fought for the preservation of a multipolar world against the unipolar. The coming fight is for two separate visions of what a unipolar world looks like.

Your theory about US collapse is sound, I'll admit. Still far from likely. As for China, the way I see it they are kept in check by their neighbors like India. With that and multipolarity being their entire geopolitical platform, I don't see them being this totalitarian globalist ruler. However I will say that once the US does collapse the dissident situation will be different and Russia and China would no longer be necessary. But it's "trust the plan" level foolish to expect a US collapse within our lifetimes let alone the next couple decades.

[NuclearAbsolutist]

snip

It is the strangest thing to me this confidence in promoting these two powers as firm  when you self admittedly haven't studied them on a cultural level(Which naturally causes me to raise a eyebrow on your claims on everything within those lands besides that). Such as you claiming a Communist Party Of Chinese is National Socialist, let me quote The Leader on a definition of the term:

National Socialists there is but one doctrine: People and Fatherland. What we must fight for is to safeguard the existence and reproduction of our race and our people, the sustenance of our children and the purity of our blood, the freedom, and independence of the fatherland, so that our people may mature for the fulfillment of the mission allotted it by the creator of the universe.

The CCP does none of the above. The CCP put first equality and the leveling of all social mores as with all Marxist Leninist regimes and when the numbers came back it was a mistaken path they took a few steps back. Now it sits plotting as the decay common to all nations of modernity seeps in and the birth rate tanks loudly proclaiming it will avenge what white people did to it as all Marxist Leninist regimes do. Of course this is a lie like all Marxist Leninist regimes the true goal is apparatchiks can wrangle wealth and maybe fill in a few map spots if the Han dare question such polices as having niggers next to the female dorms at universities the resulting movement is to be suppressed with tanks as all Marxist Leninist regimes do. There is beyond facades nothing based about either nation with such chest thumping usually done as a cope for lacking in material and strategic capabilities compared to the grand Yank alliance(I will say at least the Chinese have something in terms of organization and goal the modern Russian state exists for and exclusively run by Soviet born raised and risen up the ladder civil servants and their nepotistic spawn-and it really shows!).

[Guest]

...

What do you know about Chinese culture, having done so much research? All you've basically done with your post is take the term Marxist Leninist and throw it around as you please. For context, the Marxist Leninist party in Russia is ultra nationalist and willing to compromise with Christianity for the common good. If you think western leftism is in any way similar to communism, you are quite mistaken. There is no victim narrative or biological Leninism. Why do you think it is that the west is the one that adopted these ideas, do you think communists are secretly in control or just maybe the real source of the poison is liberalism? I don't know how people purity spiral into this idea of strict Nazism, national socialism itself was a compromise between worker's grievance and combatting international finance. And what do you know, communism champions both of these causes. Getting caught up in pointless details is a waste of energy.

[NuclearAbsolutist]

snip

On China I know Chinese culture was in most  aspects cleared out in favor in favor of raising up a race that spits on the floor and as I said develop similar moral crises of our time(No families loose women government of faceless bureaucracy with no higher sense ruling over a people with no higher sense etc). As for western leftism and communism those indeed are the same. The only differences being arguments of how to achieve the end goal of one faithless raceless and sexless human biomass. The USSR, the first socialist movement to form a state EXPLICITLY from the very start considered the now defunct Russian Empire a prison of nations, and worked to separate  the land Russians had bled for centuries for into ethnic nationally liberated republics where Russian was phased out and Russians to be ruled other by the ethnics-as the USSR was founded(And ruled until the very end continuing onward in the Russian Federation that rose from it) by racial and religious aliens. There are cases in the 1930s of those who did acts as simple as waving the Russian tricolor to have been executed, and that's before getting into how as a whole the Soviet Union and wider socialism can be seen as parasitic taking of income generated by Russia and handing it out be it to failing enterprises in Tatarstan or various movements in the Third World moving to liquidate the white man. On the matter of liberalism I do not consider it a useful descriptor for the beliefs that would have Wall St help the economy of said anti patriarchy anti religion and anti imperialist(anti white) Soviet Union in the 1930s, save it from the Axis in WWII, have a Cold War over which side would have the PROPER materialist worldview to make everyone equal after the HORRORS of eugenics and of course the clincher in my mind if we are going to have a practical politics debate, completely wipe out or make feeble the governments of all commie nations or tie itself to them strangely, if they don't like them according to  our learned professors that prattle now about real politics and the common good(the politics of real communism erm communitarianism naturally are the true silver bullet despite being promoted since the 70s, to zero effect)

[rockies]

Not a single one of the guest posters have been able to stop drooling on themselves for a moment- the thread is being filled with the turgid smell of stale hot-pockets. Here is where skin in the game and a little bit of assumed dignity would be beneficial for the sake of the argument, at least. Could you perhaps bring some information to the table that you didn't scrape off of the truck-station bathroom that is Battle Beagle's twitter account? I'm not overly happy that you've shat up what could have been a promising thread.

Muh Semiconductors, Muh Taiwan, Muh Tiktok

Three-year old information, so it falls under the "nothing happens" category. Not useful. Tiktok was a one-way flow of Western culture back out into the world, targeted because a couple geriatrics fancied an easy target. Also not useful.

I'm willing to "settle" for Russia and China because their resources are absolutely necessary in this struggle.

You're a whore, and not a particularly expensive one, either. What exactly is allying with two fading powers on the other side of the world going to do for you? Russia isn't going to ship you steel-case, China isn't going to get you Yuan or whatever. You say "resources" in the abstract, in the same manner that you use "socialism". These words you use don't mean anything, they're vague gestures at husks.

If you think western leftism is in any way similar to communism, you are quite mistaken. There is no victim narrative or biological Leninism. Why do you think it is that the west is the one that adopted these ideas, do you think communists are secretly in control or just maybe the real source of the poison is liberalism? I don't know how people purity spiral into this idea of strict Nazism, national socialism itself was a compromise between worker's grievance and combatting international finance. And what do you know, communism champions both of these causes. Getting caught up in pointless details is a waste of energy.

Most eminently moronic thing I've heard since I was locked a week ago. Buzzword index at 10%, whereas the threshold should be closer to about 3% for reasonable work. This kind of styrofoam writing style is immediately apparent as the signature of the DUMB WORDCEL, who plays algebra with entire words and terms to make them roughly equal (and thus appealing) to his basal mind. "Socialism beats International Finance! Liberalism Causes Socialism! Therefore, Support Communism to Beat Liberalism And Thus Socialism! Shocking! Read my Substack!" So long as the focus is on this retarded, Mad-Libs politics, we move nowhere.

Let me be firm here- NOTHING the "Communist" says means anything. The words themselves have been stripmined of all value- it's why we have such success squatting in their toxic pit-mines when we want to have a laugh. They are nations of (best-case recovering) parasites, which the guest may understand on some level, which contain nothing of value. This concept that ideas have influence on lesser races is farcical- that a Maoist is distinct from a Confucianist, that both are somehow different shades of "Communist" is missing the forest for the trees, when one can biologically describe the group. Ideologies are chiefly justifications for biological urges- suggesting that one deals with the "communists" is like suggesting we deal with "blue" or the concept of "time".

So. "Would the Han support us?" A Century of Humiliation tells us, no. Not in any meaningful capacity, even to spite the countries we came from. Perhaps just enough support to make us into an embarrassment or a frustration for our mother nations, but nothing past that- no more Western strength for the Han, which is fine, as they have nothing to offer us that isn't already ours by right.

"Would the Russians help us?" No. They are currently struggling with a war on their borders. Neither side is doing well. There are not excess resources to devote to "us" thru normal channels, no competents to help us covertly.

[Guest]

...

It's hard to find an actual argument in this post. Basically, you're of the opinion that communism of the USSR was a terrible stain on this Earth and all communism to follow is an imitation of that original. Honestly I don't know what to say to make someone stop being so much of a neocon. If culture and ideology is really this huge breaking point, I agree that your project should have nothing to do with Russia or China. Your conception of "action" seems to involve movementatianism and even awakening of the masses so on this subject we're on completely different pages. I didn't think I'd have to remind the users here that voting does nothing.

[JohnnyRomero]

Chyna, along with India and perhaps the Arabs, is a clear paper tiger. It is an old, sclerotic, and exhausted civilization which has actively avoided outward expansion and foreign adventures for the past 2000 years. Any energy which Chyna has is just a reflection of the West, in much the same way that the Moon reflects the Sun's light. Modern "Chyna" is to the West as the Seleucids were to the Greeks and Romans: an ancient, foreign civilization, now thoroughly colonized by their own ideas. Communism, global Turd World revolution, technology, apps, spacefaring, etc., all are just Western concepts and inventions which the Chinese have adopted in hopes of imitating and overcoming massa. This won't work, of course, because they have no genuine creative energy. The Wuhan lab was a great case study in this - even to this day, most Chinese research is funded and directed by Americans. We will have our Mithridaitic War with them and they shall be brought to heel - although to defeat them the West will likely be forced to quit its bullshit, facilitating the end of liberalism and the dawn of Trumpist Caesarism and the Augustan Age of Amarna. Remember that a hundred Mongols, Tibetans, or Japs could easily dominate an army of a thousand chinks or more in the old days. Then how much more could a few well-armed and technologically-adept Aryans make sport of them? Chyna is a joke, and by portraying them as some inevitable enemy of America and liberator of browns you are swallowing their firm three inches of propaganda with glee. At the same time, their irrelevancy and dependence on the modern Western system also means that they cannot be relied upon as a savior or even an ally against the system. We must win this battle ourselves.

[Guest]

...

I actually appreciate your input highly. You offer strong arguments and good insight into the mind of the average anon. "Nothing happens" is not an unreasonable stance, but from what I can see the west's soft power being used to pressure China will keep escalating the situation until it reaches the peak. And since both the US and China are declining nations, one will have to lash out in an attempt to survive.

What exactly is allying with these powers going to do for me? You say they do not have anything to give and that resources are a vague gesture. It's a strange way to talk about the capabilities of literal superpowers. But it's a great question, sure I can pitch these lofty ideas like power but do I really know a damn thing about the nitty gritty behind it? How exactly could a worthwhile operation receive worthwhile support? Let's say for example you wanted a network that provided intelligence and funding to dissident organizations to give them a chance to thrive. How would you build such a thing? You would need equipment and men with specialized training. These things don't just grow on trees. Of course, I haven't built such an operation myself so you may have better plans on going about it, but in my mind Russia or China's resources would be invaluable in such a situation and easier to secure than you expect. In the underground operations business, you basically need to be able to make sales pitches to investors. Is that such a big ask on this site where its users are the near the pinnacle of modern human capability?

I'll not address your last paragraph because I've laid out enough new material already, but your assessment of me as a wordcel is real. I'm not an influencer or personality, at the moment I'm just an anon who's read a lot of books and has a lot of fire in his heart. Maybe I'm just a naive and misguided kid, but I'm here so that we can help each other. You help me toss out any ideas that are too hot to be practical, I help you become a little bit more inspired and capable of seeing the world in a new light. We're revolutionaries, let's start taking the steps necessary to changing the world.

[NuclearAbsolutist]

Basically, you're of the opinion that communism of the USSR was a terrible stain on this Earth and all communism to follow is an imitation of that original.

Yes I concur with every admirable Western thinker and leader since the 19th century  that Marxism is a abomination or I should say was  as it is my view following the post war thinker Augusto Del Noce

So, the historical result of Marxism is, on the one side, Communist
reality, in the way it has become realized, and, on the other, the affluent
society[His term for modern decadent western society], in a non-dialectic form of opposition.
From the standpoint of mere observation the data of the crisis seem
to be the following:
In a certain sense, Marxism has already completely won, but only by
negating itself most totally.

What did he mean by this? Well its clearly apparent even more so than in 1964 when he wrote that, the Marxist government was bankrupt morally, and failed to live up to any of its stated goals of economic equality, progress or raising up human dignity instead forming police states that suppressed anyone who dared not appear to be on the program to totally remake man, paranoid of what was beyond the Berlin Wall. They would fall to De Noce's affluent society be it in the spectacular events of 1989-1992 or how China went on the path of economic reforms that would lead to its own IPhone generation spiritually and physically. It has been totally negated, nothing remains of socialism practically on all levels from the conceptual to material outside its legacy of destruction. I make pains to stake out my view here because you appear to be under the impression there are alternative or ways of communism that don't lead to a nation being reduced to a penal colony run by Jews or their spiritual equivalents to then be puppeted by the alleged "liberalism" you so hate. That is not the case, the entire belief system terminates in the image of the fallow field, the rusted mill and the rotten corpse. My view here is naturally different from the ex trot neocon you say I am who sees something admirable in 1917 or sweated that it COULD have been so different a real success under Trotsky, and made various compromises and deals with the reds to the very end until their favorite boxing partner imploded. My view here is also not of needing a "Movement" or parliaments as I said earlier in this thread:

In reality baring national proxy conflicts every radical movement now has to draw on nations within nations and parasitism on the ruling government(Ie traitors, officials willing to sell out etc) along with networks of all kinds-esp since the end of the cold war.

To spell it out I was referring to the actions of organizations such as the cream of the madrasa the Taliban and Tamil Tigers. I don't know how you got the idea I am somehow for da masses.

[Guest]

...

Sorry your writing style is not something I'm familiar with and I made a bad hasty observation of your ideas. I'm not entirely opposed to your idea of "lone wolfing" things which is shared by every user here. It's the practical means of executing that strategy that worries me. The DR has produced nothing of value by itself, and I think it lacks the tools necessary to do so. Of course, that inspires me towards the idea of a dissident network that doesn't demand ideological conformity only unity of purpose and a means of producing results. But on the subject of this lone wolf style operation, I've combed every inch of this thread and seen nothing but vague theoryceling. Since I've led this thread to the discussion of practical politics and dynamics of power, could you elaborate on your idea, give me your pitch? I think there is a lot we can learn from each other.

---

We must win this battle ourselves.

Not an idea I particularly dislike, I used to believe in such a thing myself. But successful revolutions don't materialize out of thin air, what's your vision for how this plays out? Even Hitler ended up failing in the end, though his people's valiant effort will not be forgotten. How will this tiny minority of individuals fundamentally change the world and take modern society off its current trajectory of soulless technological singularity?

[NuclearAbsolutist]

could you elaborate on your idea, give me your pitch?

My analysis and suggestion is a plain one, at the moment one can only lessen the foulness around yourself and others via such means as civic bodies self organization what have you. I do not mean to propose lone wolf methods however understandable such efforts are they betray a fundamental misunderstanding of the current situation. That being such one off, usually less deadly and stressing for the system than a week end in Chicago attacks are what cause awakenings, no they are products of national awakenings. At the moment to our great lament(some argue it always so)  the masses are firmly asleep. Such movements as idealized by so many on "our side" require at least some element of the people to be not so to be the water to the organizations fish, and we don't even have a puddle. So are we to do as I implicitly suggest sit back with range days, pro law and order approaches and litter clean up? No! For there is a phenomenon even those in prison cells can draw on and quake the world with as told by Carlyle

There was once a man called Rousseau who wrote a book containing nothing but ideas. The second edition was bound in the skins of those who laughed at the first.

We can do the same as those in the 18th century coffee house examine society, wipe out the dirt that covers the windows  and let in the rays of the sun. With so many decades of lies like cobwebs in everyones mind even the dissenter from the world of lies, and no sense of bearing or direction, and the already stated conditions at play limiting action, plumbing the depths of intellect and observation of our conditions  may be the main ability we have-and most important thing to do. Most of the greatest acts in history follow from such a preamble, I think this forum and others like it can join that thread of Western history.

[anthony]

What the hell happened to this thread?

[rockies]

Guests were permitted to "contribute". A dire warning.

[anthony]

Guests were permitted to "contribute". A dire warning.

I believe that as a general rule of the internet lurkers are the best posters, and so guest posting has potentially great value. It also allows no risk no commitment drive by and snipe posting from retards, degenerates, and lower-case morality-police, but it's all energy for the system. It's not impossible to read the character of a Guest poster. We don't have history to go on, but their decision to post as a guest says things too. Guest posting is rare for forums and I like having it here. Results are interesting.

[honey moon groyper]

What the hell happened to this thread?

Getting back on track . . . 
Mikka's plan is good. I could quibble with some of his points, but it is certainly >90% accurate. With that said, the question remains: What ought a Sensitive Young Man do in the world today? Others have suggested it and I agree, there are two paths: the criminal and the law-abiding. Even if one endorses engaging in criminal activity to bring about the KEYED STATT, does anyone seriously think that more than 10% of the work that must be done will be criminal? The vast majority of us ought to become upper-middle class business men. At the end of the day, the largest thing most of us could do to support Meritocracy is to write a check for $50K at the right moment to the right person. Yes, its true: foreign languages, artistic talent, web dev, military skills, legal resources, etc. are all very useful. Some of us should get into those things! But even those activities (become a Navy SEAL and starting a private security company with enough contractors to form a battalion) which seem more interesting than owning a chain of laundromats, will inevitably require a similar amount of plain business acumen. In so far as we are talking about what we should be doing now, let's start a thread: "How to get a bank to loan you $100K to start a small business."